Today I brought on our new coach Tyler Ramsey to discuss the best way to approach an LGBTQ Ex.

The LGBTQ breakup situation is one in which Ex Boyfriend Recovery was sorely lacking in advice and after discussing it with Tyler we determined that there are enough subtle difference that we are going to begin working on creating an entire section of our website dedicated to it.

This in depth interview with Tyler is our first step towards that initiative.

Let’s begin!

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Best Way To Get Your LGBTQ Ex Back

Chris Seiter:
All right, today, I brought on our new coach, Tyler Ramsey, to talk to us about the best way to approach an LGBTQ ex, which what was shocking to Tyler and I is when we looked around Google, there’s not too much information out there on this specific type of a situation. So, we wanted to put something together to show you some of the main differences between a general breakup, I guess, versus the LGBTQ breakup and some of the challenges that they face. We were getting and talking a little bit before we started recording about what some of those differences are, and I actually think they’re pretty major and they’re game-changing in how you need to approach getting your ex back, if that’s the approach that you want to take. But, anyways, Tyler, how are you doing? Sorry for the long intro.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, no, I’m doing okay, how about you, Chris? Thanks for having me again.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah. We’re doing good. I know Tyler and Anna have been non-stop coaching for pretty much all of February here, and you guys are … How’s it going?

Tyler Ramsey:
So, it’s been very busy. We’ve had a lot of clients, and also juggling my general surgery rotation as well at the same time has been very interesting. I have not gotten any sleep.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah, we were supposed to do this podcast yesterday, but Tyler was like, “Hey, do you mind if I push it back a day? I haven’t slept in 24 hours.” And I’m like, “Yeah, that’s probably a good idea.”

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, I can probably think a little bit better now.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah, sleep is amazing and how that occurs.

Tyler Ramsey:
It really is.

Chris Seiter:
Okay, so there’s a lot of ways that we can approach this, but the first thing that really came to your mind about the big differences between an LGBTQ type of a situation versus a general breakup situation was the fear of loss being greater for an LGBTQ relationship, but it comes later. And I stole are rhyme from you because that’s what you said.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, so it’s kind of an interesting concept. Like I said, I should preface everything with this is general patterns from what I’ve noticed, and so, of course, this doesn’t apply to every situation, but, most of the time, I feel like it does. And so it really boils down to this: the fear of loss is greater later, but it’s not usually seen at the beginning because of the casualties sometimes around relationships. I feel like the LGBTQ community sometimes can have more casual relationships, and so they’re usually very good about being friends after a breakup, and that kind of thing.

Tyler Ramsey:
But, most of the time, it takes a lot longer for them to go, “Hey, well, that was a good relationship that I had. What happened? Why did it breakup?” And they almost circle back. But, most of the time, it just ends and then they’re okay for a while. And it’s kind of what I told you earlier, I feel like of all the attachment styles, I feel like fearful-avoidant is a bigger one in this community, so the fear of loss heightens later, instead of at the beginning of a breakup.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah. Well, the first thing that came to my mind when you told me about the fear of loss coming later is this does sound … So, I did all this research on avoidants and how to make avoidants miss you, and, man, I’m telling you, you can go down into the rabbit hole and learn some really fascinating things, and one of the things that really fascinated me most about how avoidants view breakups is they almost have to feel like you have moved on completely before they feel comfortable missing you or regretting their decision. And I’m wondering if that’s happening here?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, I definitely think that that’s more in play with this. There are general exes that are avoidants and they do take longer to come back around. But essentially what it does is they have almost this freeing sensation after the breakup. It’s like you don’t want to approach them to where they’re emotional, almost like an avoidant in what you said. I really feel like that’s why when you feel like you’ve moved on is when they feel comfortable coming back and talking about it, it’s because the emotional component has now been removed from that situation.

Chris Seiter:
So, pretty much the standard thing that we tell everyone when they’re first starting out going through a breakup is going into a no-contact rule, and there’s these different timeframes of no-contact rules. Now, we recommend three different timeframes, 21, 30, and 45 days. And we don’t have a lot of content on LGBTQ out there, no one really does. So, obviously, once data comes in, we’ll be able to harp on exactly the “best timeframe,” so to speak, from actual data. But, for example, we have those three timeframes, 21 days, 30 days, 45 days. Do you think in a situation where fear of loss happens later, you should extend your no-contact rule to be one of the longer periods of no contact, just to start out with?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah. So, that’s something that I feel like more of a standard approach. I definitely think you need to be more on the 30 or 45-day no-contact with them. Any kind of attachment style that has avoidants in it, technically you want to stay more on that 30 or 45 days. And so I feel like that’s more of a better recommendation on how to handle these situations.

Chris Seiter:
So, in your estimation, is 45 days long enough for that fear of loss to kick in, or can it take longer sometimes?

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Tyler Ramsey:
So, sometimes it can take longer, honestly. I’ve noticed that, a lot of times, you try these no-contacts, and then you just leave them alone for a long time, and they circle back. And so it’s kind of interesting though, but I do think that 45 days is probably a more appropriate no-contact time, just because they do typically lean more avoidant. However, the caveat to that, and circling back to the beginning part of the question of why did they feel the fear of loss? Well, the reason why it is that way is because the dating pool is much smaller, so there’s not nearly as many options, nearly as many people to pick from, and typically everyone knows everyone in this community by the end [crosstalk 00:07:20].

Chris Seiter:
Okay, so they’re all meeting and networking, and sometimes dating around.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes.

Chris Seiter:
So, to me, it seems that’s already one big difference from the general strategy that we teach because we give people an option, based on their situation, of course, of periods of no contact. You’re basically saying your standard no-contact should be 45 days, and it might actually have to be longer than that if you have an extreme fearful avoidant ex?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, I definitely think so. Even the ones that lean more dismissive that I’ve seen, you’re going to have to really give them some time because you have to remember, I feel like with these kind of attachment styles, they avoid conflict and they avoid emotions altogether, so that’s why I told you that I feel like a lot of the relationships can be more casual because they don’t have that emotional component to them because they are afraid of it. That applies to other relationships as well, like fearful-avoidant and dismissive-avoidant, but it is just more prevalent in this community, I feel like, because that’s how they’ve adapted from their attachment style from childhood.

Chris Seiter:
Okay, so this is also interesting. Let’s say you go with a longer period of no contact, the next rung on the ladder that we tend to tell people is to engage in texting. Is there any major differences between the general strategy we recommend to, let’s say, a man or a woman who are trying to get back together, versus an LGBTQ couple trying to get back together, when it comes to texting?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah. So, I feel like being way more casual, but also-

Chris Seiter:
So, when you say “casual,” you mean like less available?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, so less available, but not emotional. So, I know a lot of the things that we teach, traditionally, are you just don’t want to go full-fledged emotion at the beginning, and that’s kind of standard for any kind of texting phase that you’re going to go through, but it’s really important with them. And it also is very important to not skip value chain. I think that is extremely important. You will really mess it up if you skip the value chain because if you give them exactly what they want, they’ll just discard.

Chris Seiter:
I guess the same principles also apply … Okay, so this is where it gets interesting to me. So, the no-contact rule, longer no contact; texting, you want to be maybe a little less available than the average breakup. I mean the whole point of the value ladder, value chain concept is that in each method of communication, you’re building up value. So, by the time you get to that phone call or the FaceTimes or the video chats or the Zoom calls or what have you, is it okay to open up a little bit, or do you still need to stay playing hard to get?

Tyler Ramsey:
So, I always stay on the you don’t want to show all your cards, so you want to show them very, very subtly. I do think that you can open up, there are ways to open up though that do not allow you to be quite as vulnerable, but to test the waters. Those kinds of text messages, I think, work a lot better because, a lot of the times, I’ve noticed when you’re more vulnerable, they can avoid, and then they won’t tell you how they feel. But that’s more than avoidant personality, too.

Chris Seiter:
So, is it a situation where you need to test them and see if they’re going to dip their toe in the water first before you go in the water?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes.

Chris Seiter:
Got it. That makes a lot of sense.

Tyler Ramsey:
I think you need to get a little confirmation about that before you open yourself up because that’s why I said skipping the value chain’s big with this, and you don’t want to.

Chris Seiter:
Right. So, I’m just going to go out on a limb here and say that LGBTQ breakups are probably, on average, going to take longer to succeed in getting back together than the regular breakup that we tend to encounter?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, I would agree. If you’re wanting them back, permanently, I’ll phrase that, because there are situations where I’ve seen that the ex comes back, and then, two weeks later, is like, “I want you back, I want to talk about it,” that kind of thing, they get back together, they don’t work out the problems, and then it just breaks up again. And that would go in our favor of the rules that we set for in no-contact of if they ask for me back and they want that kind of thing, you’re supposed to break no-contact, and so that’s where it gets a little bit more tricky. But, most of the time, they’re missing you because there’s some need that they want met and they just enjoy the championship, which is typical of all exes though.

Chris Seiter:
Right. Okay. And so what about the dating phase, when you actually see them in person, how does that differ?

Tyler Ramsey:
Are you talk about once you’ve met up and you’ve had some interactions?

Chris Seiter:
Yeah, so let’s say everything has gone swimmingly, you’ve gone through a 45-day no-contact, you’ve spent maybe a month texting back and forth, you’re integrating that with phone calls, and your ex suggests meeting up for a cup of coffee, let’s pretend we’re out of COVID now, so we can keep it really simple, what are the rules there? Is it much of a crossroads from what we normally recommend?

Tyler Ramsey:
I do feel like it’s pretty much the same from here on out once you get there. When you meet up, it’s going to be pretty similar towards all of that. I mean, of course, you’re going to do certain things, you’re going to go out to eat, if we’re not talking about COVID or that kind of thing. But I think it’s also important though that you do hold your ground on things such as affection, sex, that kind of thing. I think that is where you really have to hold out because if you give that, that gives the casualty of the relationship back and it then becomes a situationship again, instead of a here’s-the-relationship.

Chris Seiter:
All right, so Tyler had explained his terminology to me before. Explain exactly what you mean by “situationship”.

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Tyler Ramsey:
Okay. So, I feel like situationship is the new term for our generation, honestly.

Chris Seiter:
Okay. That’s the millennial term for casual, basically?

Tyler Ramsey:
It is. And a lot of people, whether it’s LGBT or just a regular hetero relationship, and so I feel like the casualty of the relationship’s comfortable. So, I feel like a situationship means this: a little bit greater version of a friends-with-benefits. So, they’re a companion, they are there for them. It’s basically all of the perks of the relationship, except that they don’t have to make time for you if they don’t want to, and they can discard you at any point. And so it’s kind of like that.

Chris Seiter:
Okay. That just seems like a raw deal.

Tyler Ramsey:
It is.

Chris Seiter:
It seems like a really crappy deal to me.

Tyler Ramsey:
And I don’t think a lot of people are upfront about it though. It’s not something that’s mutually agreed upon at the beginning, it’s just this unconscious thing going on in the back of their head that they don’t even know that’s what’s happening.

Chris Seiter:
Well, what’s interesting about is do you think a lot of these situationships occur because the two parties never effectively communicate what they want? Maybe one person wants it, the other person doesn’t it, but the other person’s so afraid of losing that person that they allow it to happen.

Tyler Ramsey:
Exactly. That’s exactly right. And that goes along with fearful-avoidant attachment style, they’re not very upfront about their own needs until it becomes so great that they get so irritated that it just blows up, and so that’s how I feel like the cycle occurs, and so not being upfront about your own needs is very essential in this kind of relationship, for sure. Also, though, I think it goes along with that, basically the only difference between a situationship and a relationship, in my opinion, is commitment. You’re committed to that person through thick and thin, you don’t have a way out.

Chris Seiter:
So, it is basically like the heterosexual version of friends-with-benefits, basically?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, pretty much. You just see it more common, I feel like, in this kind of relationship, but you see it more in an avoidant attachment style.

Chris Seiter:
So, there’s a lot already that I think is different about LGBTQ situations, specifically it’s going to take longer, it’s going to require a lot of discipline, a lot of patience, and I feel, this is just my opinion, and I’m really curious to get your take on this, one thing I notice with just the average person that we coach, for example, they have a really hard time when they get to that in-person phase of withholding sex.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes.

Chris Seiter:
So, any type of physical touch or anything, they’re just like, “Okay, this is going to be the thing that gets them to commit,” and I imagine the LGBTQ community has the same problem.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah. Exactly. I definitely think so.

Chris Seiter:
Is the thinking the same there though, like for a guy who’s trying to get his ex-boyfriend back, for example? Is the thinking, “If I do this, this is going to make them realize that they can commit to me”?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, definitely.

Chris Seiter:
Okay.

Tyler Ramsey:
For sure. I think that goes through a lot of people’s heads, and so that’s something I feel like is important not to do. And so you have to be very cognizant of that, just for that reason, because I feel like casualty is a big thing, not emotional, they don’t have to worry about it, it doesn’t require big emotional needs from somebody.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah. Okay, so the other thing that we really haven’t talked about or touched on really is the out-or-not concept.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah. We could probably make a whole video just on that.

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Chris Seiter:
Well, let’s see if we can fill the rest of the time talking about that then.

Tyler Ramsey:
And I also have another thing that I feel like is a very good thing to talk about as well that we can talk about after this. Being out versus not out, that’s something that nothing is dealt with in another kind of relationship. This is specific to this community. The only other kind of community I feel like this might apply to is if two people are extremely religious and they’re hiding their relationship, also.

Chris Seiter:
I’ve seen that a lot, actually. You’ll see that a lot in the Middle Eastern culture. All right.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, so I feel like that applies.

Chris Seiter:
All right, so I’m really curious to hear, first, let’s get your thoughts out on it, and then I got questions about the out-or-not thing, for sure.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah. So, I feel like this is a really controversial thing, but I’m going to try to make it as clear-cut as possible. In my opinion, and especially me dating in this kind of community as well, it’s tough to navigate with this because you can really like someone, and they can be really compatible and all that kind of thing, but this one thing can really derail the entire relationship and the ability to get them back, so it is a double-whammy.

Chris Seiter:
So, you’re talking in terms of you’re trying to date someone who is not out and you are out?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes.

Chris Seiter:
And it’s this huge gulf between the two?

Tyler Ramsey:
It is. It can be a huge gulf, depending upon where the other person is along in their journey. And I’ll elaborate on that. It takes a long time to get to a point of self-acceptance, and usually there’s a lot of self-hatred from that person, and they’re very afraid to be who they are. Even though I do think they really care about somebody and that person, it does put a massive constraint on them, which causes significant amounts of anxiety, which can cause a lot of fights in a relationship, just on the mere fact that a person is not out because you’re hiding from the world.

Tyler Ramsey:
And so who’s going to see me? If I post on this social media, what are people going to think? That kind of thing. Things that you couldn’t do in a normal relationship now become a hardship, just for that point. And so when getting an ex back specifically, I feel like that’s important to think about. And if this person is not on a journey or close to doing that, I think it’s time to close that door, as painful as that actually is because it’s always going to have those tumultuous things that go on in it.

Chris Seiter:
So, basically, for you, that is the game-changer.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes, I do.

Chris Seiter:
Do you have any idea of why it is so difficult to deal with this kind of a gulf, why it’s impossible to bridge the gulf? Because I imagine a lot of people who are in situations like this are going to think, “Well, I’ll be the one to get them to finally come out.”

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, a lot of people think that way. So, I do think that there are some situations where that does occur, I mean we’ve had success stories in the group, but I do think that this is the rule that applies to that, if that person is on the cuff of coming out, of, “All right, I’ve self-accepted myself, I just need to find a time to do it,” it’s a little bit different than someone that is just now finding themselves.

Chris Seiter:
Can I ask you a question about that though? Let’s say someone is on the cusp, how do you differentiate between someone saying that they’re on the cusp of coming out versus saying it because they think that it’s what you want to hear? So, how do you know if it’s authentic?

Tyler Ramsey:
So, that is kind of hard, and sometimes you don’t know, and so that’s why I feel like if this is the situation the person’s in, just going into a complete no-contact is the best thing to do because what it does is it really elicits the fear of loss because now that becomes the confounding factor on why they broke up, and so they’re like, “Well, I’m going to lose this person forever if I just don’t own up to who I am.” And sometimes you don’t know when you are doing something like that, if that’s what’s going to be the straw that breaks the camel’s back; sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn’t, and that’s when you know essentially that that means that person is just not in a place yet to do it.

Chris Seiter:
Okay. So, the out-or-not thing is a huge topic with regards to your overall chances of success, probably, in this situation. It’s going to be hard to have … All right, so this is actually a different approach to taking it. Do you think the person being out or not has any impact on your success chances, or are you talking more of a perspective, like, “Hey, if you do get this person back, you’re going to be in that on-again/off-again, you’re going to break up again”?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes. You probably are, if there’s no change or no commitment to change. And you have to be careful with just the commitment to change. You can verbalize that you’re going to commit to change, but doing it is a totally different thing. As far as success, I’ll leave it like this, there’s two components to it. I think that your overall chances of success are lower, but they’re lower for a short amount of time. Let’s say you’re saying chance of success within three to six months of this, I think, are significantly lower. I think your chances of success longer out are higher.

Chris Seiter:
That’s interesting.

Tyler Ramsey:
Because-

Chris Seiter:
See, it’s the opposite with every other situation.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, I do. I think that there is a higher chance of success years down the road when that person actually does do that, and then they go, “Well, we had all these problems because I just wasn’t ready,” the regret sets in. They’re balancing the fear of coming out versus the love of another person, and sometimes fear ends up winning out in the situation. Eventually, when that comes off, only regret is there left.

Chris Seiter:
It’s interesting. Well, I can understand why people would be afraid to come out because it feels like they’re probably … they’re probably building it up like it’ll blow their life up, and, in some cases, it probably could, and, in other cases, it’s maybe an overblown fear that they have. But I can definitely see why that is such an impact on your overall game plan. But you said that there was something else that you wanted to talk about.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah. The out thing is a huge thing, and there are definitely some people that I know that have gotten their ex back after the 30 days, but I do feel like those people are more to a place of self-acceptance, they just needed that little push to set them over. That is such a personal choice, and it actually will build resentment towards another person if they feel like they’re doing it for the other person, which creates a whole nother set of problems trying to get an ex back or trying to rekindle a relationship.

Chris Seiter:
So, even if you do play chicken with the no-contact rule here, it can end up backfiring in a long-term perspective because then that person is regretful or resentful about coming out not because they wanted to, but because they felt this necessity to come out to get you back.

Tyler Ramsey:
The pressure. Or even while in the relationship, if you played the hot-and-cold game, where you got them back, and then the pressure got out of, “You need to come out,” then the resentment might get build right there. I think there’s less of a chance of that happening breaking up though.

Chris Seiter:
So, in other words, the perfect situation for an LGBTQ is if both members are out.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes, that is the point of the whole the entire thing, you need both parties out to have a successful relationship. I really do not think it can be … The overall chances of the success of the relationship and the ability to rekindle it are low without those two components.

Chris Seiter:
I’m curious about your take on this, and I haven’t looked at the recent figures, but you can often see the divorce rates for heterosexual couples, and then you can see the LGBTQ community, and it’s off the charts. Do you think it’s because of this reason, like there’s this resentment?

Tyler Ramsey:
So, you’re saying that there’s a higher divorce rate with LGBTQ?

Chris Seiter:
Yeah. So, I haven’t looked at the most recent statistics, but when I last looked, it was over 70% or something crazy like that, and I’m just curious why, from your perspective, do you think … the resentment aspect, I think, could play a role, but there might be something else to it.

Tyler Ramsey:
So, I actually didn’t know the statistic, but I can formulate why that would be the case. I really actually think the case is because of the casualties of the relationships. There’s more insecure attachment style, I think, in the community, and it’s not their fault either, that’s what I want to preface with too. Well, any insecure attachment style is done from some kind of trauma in their childhood, and I feel like this community experiences much more of it, from the aspects of coming out, being in situations where they have emotional trauma for that reason, like their parents may not have accepted them, society may not have accepted them, friends may not, and it plays a huge role in how they developed.

Chris Seiter:
That’s where it gets really complicated too because if you think about it … All right, so my house, I don’t think we have any gay couples near, but I can guarantee you, if one moves in, everyone starts talking about it, and imagine you’re in this bubble with this person who you love more than anyone, but it’s also kind of like, “Look at all these people throwing rocks at us.” I imagine that has to take a toll, too.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, you do, you fight self-acceptance. And that’s why I told you it’s very, very imperative that both parties are 100% secure in their own sexuality and they’re out, or it will fall apart because the insecurity ends up infiltrating the relationship to begin with, and so-

Chris Seiter:
So, that’s a super important thing.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes. And that’s why I feel like the divorce rate could be higher is because there’s unresolved security issues because of the insecure attachment styles, and that’s due to the trauma induced earlier in their life because of all the stuff they experienced against society, experiencing with their parents or friend groups, or not being self-accepted, and feeling different. That’s the same thing with the fearful-avoidant attachment style and dismissive, it’s trauma-induced that causes that, so that’s why their relationships, I feel like, are more casual because the commitment issue is scarier to them because they’ve never truly tried to rely on other people in their life because of being so afraid of relying on them from being hurt. So, that’s why you have these situationships going on, I feel like.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah, I mean if you really think about it too, human beings are very tribal by nature, so you get into these tribal groups of what’s acceptable, well, everyone knows there’s this really … What was it? Just a few years ago, I think, marriage got legalized around the country, didn’t it?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, 2015. It has really not been that long.

Chris Seiter:
So, it’s very new.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah.

Chris Seiter:
It’s very tribal. There’s people out there who are not okay with the LGBTQ community, period, and so I imagine that has to take a toll, so that probably all goes into that out-or-not concept, and it just feeds into and almost corrupts the relationship-

Tyler Ramsey:
It does.

Chris Seiter:
And it’s not their fault. It’s kind of like being racist for someone based on their hair color, that’s kind of the ridiculousness of the way some of the people in this world work. They’re super racist over things that people have no control over. All right, so what other big things are we missing out on here?

Tyler Ramsey:
So, I do think that one also is actually pretty big to consider is that, I think I mentioned it earlier, or we mentioned it before we got on the call, was that everyone kind of knows everyone in this community, and I’ll elaborate. So, the sphere of influence is very important because someone knows someone, so if you tell someone, someone else is going to know something because everyone knows each other-

Chris Seiter:
Okay, so the grapevine works way better than the average grapevine.

Tyler Ramsey:
It does, yes.

Chris Seiter:
So, let’s define what we mean by sphere of influence. So, this is on YouTube, this on podcasts, some of these people aren’t in our Facebook group or haven’t done coaching. What’s the sphere of influence, Tyler, for the newbies out there?

Tyler Ramsey:
So, basically, it’s anyone in that person’s life that makes substantial influence on their decisions. I think that’s probably the best way to describe it. It could be a friend, a family member, a significant other, an ex, I mean, Lord, it could be anything.

Chris Seiter:
I’ve always looked at it like, okay, whose opinions does your ex care about the most? Those are the most important sphere-of-influence people around them. And what you’re saying, which is really interesting, it makes so much sense now that you’ve prefaced it with the casualty of the community, the sphere of influence works way better than the average situation because of maybe the size of dating pool.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes. And so things get around much quicker in this. I always make a joke about this, it’s kind of funny, if you go on your Instagram, if you ever want to figure out how to know somebody, you just go on your Instagram and you’ll probably have 10 or 15 mutual followers. That’s what’s hilarious about it. If you go get on an app and you’re trying to figure out who this is, you probably got 10 or 15 mutual friends with them. That’s the running joke though in the community. But it’s because of the limited dating pool, and, also, the fact of meeting other people is usually done through more virtual things, such as apps and stuff like that because, at the same time, you still don’t know, when you’re out in a bar, you’re not really sure who’s who.

Chris Seiter:
In your opinion, what do you think is more effective? This is just dating in general, do you think meeting somebody at a bar is better than meeting someone on Tinder, for example? Because I actually know the answer to this because I was researching it.

Tyler Ramsey:
I’m sure you’re going to say that it’s better to meet them at the bar.

Chris Seiter:
No, actually.

Tyler Ramsey:
Is it not? Really?

Chris Seiter:
No.

Tyler Ramsey:
It’s better to meet them on Tinder?

Chris Seiter:
Meeting them online is just as effective as everything else. It kind of gets a bad rap.

Tyler Ramsey:
I can believe that. I mean I have friends that met on Tinder that are engaged at the moment, so I do know that it works. And so it can work-

Chris Seiter:
It can also blow up in your face massively, but we’ll be positive today.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes, it can. Yes, it definitely can.

Chris Seiter:
But what you’re saying is the LGBTQ community is mostly, right now, meeting through online, that’s the number-one way that you’re able to network within the community?

Tyler Ramsey:
Exactly. And so I feel like that’s the easiest way to do it, unless you go to more of just a LGBTQ bar to meet somebody because I do think that there’s still some people that are just afraid to just go into any random bar and shooting your shot at another person and seeing what happens.

Chris Seiter:
For me, going up to girls in bars and doing that, I’d be shaking and everything.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah. Some people don’t do that at all.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah. Life has quickly moved more towards the swipe left, swipe right, which is kind of a weird way.

Tyler Ramsey:
It requires you to be less vulnerable is what it does.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah, that’s true.

Tyler Ramsey:
And so it teaches you not to be able to be quite as vulnerable as you should. But that is something that’s a big thing is the sphere of influence, and so you do have to be careful about what you’re doing, who you’re seeing, what you’re saying because it will get down to the grapevine a lot faster, I think, with these kinds of relationships.

Chris Seiter:
So, it can be a weapon for you or it can be a weapon against you.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes. You have to be a lot more careful, I feel like, just because everyone does know everyone.

Chris Seiter:
So, just to recap, fear of loss is greater, but later; being out or not is really, really an important thing to consider not only your success rate, but also the success rate if you potentially get this person back; the LGBTQ community, because they network within and everyone knows everyone so much, the sphere of influence is a vital importance; and, also, there’s this concept of it’s a little bit more casual, so there’s a lot of trauma that goes into some of the casual decisions people make; also, it seems like the number-one attachment style for LGBTQ exes is going to be fearful-avoidants.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes, I would definitely vouch for that, for sure, is fearful-avoidant.

Chris Seiter:
Are we missing any huge components?

Tyler Ramsey:
I think those are really the big ones that you can unpack a little more, but those are honestly the really big things to consider when navigating a LGBTQ ex, and a relationship in general, is to have these key components of you’re going to have more of the hot-and-coldness, like we’ve talked about in other videos, they’re definitely going to be more hot-and-cold, and there’s going to be-

Chris Seiter:
So, they’ll be swinging on the pendulum with the mixed signals.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes. And the casualty is something that is … and like I said at the beginning, this is not a hard and fast rule, but it is just a more common thing you deal with, and so the casualty, and not being vulnerable and as emotional at front when you do start texting phase because that tends to scare people off because what it does is it pushes commitment, and so, most of the time, running from it is what a lot of them like to do.

Chris Seiter:
That goes into that greater-but-later concept.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, greater, but later.

Chris Seiter:
Like being a little too emotional upfront can have the opposite effect than what you’re looking for, it will just usually make an ex run away, which is consistent with avoidant type of personalities.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, exactly. And, honestly, to boil it down in a one-line sentence with an LGBTQ relationship is that you’re going to be dealing with more of an avoidant attachment style, and those are the things you want to put in place with that overall, I would feel like much higher dealing with that part, and so that’s what you want to consider, moving forward with that, on top of the sphere of influence that you’re now having to deal with. That’s probably the two biggest caveats.

Chris Seiter:
That’s super good to know. So, there’s a couple of notes that I want to make here before we wrap-up. Number one is Tyler is going to be writing this massive guide for ex-boyfriend recovery on how to approach LGBTQ situations, kind of like the big alterations you’ll need to make to the overall strategies that we teach for those of you, so stay tuned for that.

Chris Seiter:
And, also, since avoidants seem to be so important to grasp how they work and looking at the world from their point of view, I recently did a video that really dives into this exactly, where we’re looking at what makes avoidants miss you and understanding their approaches. So, I imagine there’s a bit of a crossover there, for anyone who’s listening and wants to go a little bit further because, right now, we don’t have a lot of content yet on the LGBT community, but we will. It’s something that we’re going to make an effort to build out and hopefully become the predominant authority on, at least breakups, when it comes to these type of situations.

Chris Seiter:
And I guess the next thing would be coaching with Tyler. So, we are doing coaching with Tyler and Anna, and it’s really simple, you can just sign up if you want, but why don’t you explain to people what coaching with you is like?

Tyler Ramsey:
Okay. So, coaching, we do one-hour sessions on Zoom, and basically it’s just a one-on-one talk with me and you, and we just basically go through exactly what your situation is and get the details, and then build a game plan to approach your specific situation and what your situation may have in it that changes the overall strategies or the general strategies that are taught from ex-boyfriend recovery, whether that be achieving success in getting them back or moving on or any of that. And so that’s how we approach the entire call is learning exactly what’s going on in your situation, and then, the last half, we figure out what do we need to do, moving forward.

Chris Seiter:
So, if you want to sign up with Tyler, it’s pretty easy, just go to our websites. We have two websites that you can currently sign up through, ExBoyfriendRecovery and ExGirlfriendRecovery, and just look for the Coaching page. I think we’ve got a few more spots open, so take advantage of that while you can. And real quick, before we end here, Tyler, I got one question I thought of while you were talking, and I’m really kicking myself for not asking it. All right, so is there any difference between … I notice generally the strategies are the same, but the strategy between male and female when they’re trying to get their exes-

Tyler Ramsey:
I knew that’s what you were getting ready to ask. I don’t know why I thought that’s what you were getting ready to ask.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah. So, is there any big difference, or is it pretty applicable?

Tyler Ramsey:
That’s a pretty good question actually. I think it’s probably more applicable across both genders, to be honest, so I do feel like it’s similar patterns.

Chris Seiter:
So, there might be some subtle differences, but pretty much it’s very similar to just normal relationships in ex-boyfriend recovery, ex-girlfriend recovery, trying to get their heterosexual exes back. There are subtle differences, but the overall strategy doesn’t change much, I would imagine maybe the same thing happens with the LGBTQ side of things?

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, I totally agree. I know we make this huge generalization of guys are more avoidant and girls are more anxious, and so therefore they process a breakup faster than males might because of that dynamic. However, you do see differences in both all the time, and I have clients that break that rule all the time, where you have a guy that’s more anxious and you have a girl that’s more avoidant. But, in general, I do feel like, across the board on both male and female LGBTQ relationships, it basically applies with that more avoidant attachment style. And so I still do see exceptions to that rule, but, generally, approaching either one, I feel like, is pretty similar.

Chris Seiter:
Well, what’s also interesting is you get really complicated with it because we’re just talking about sexual preferences here. Imagine an LGBTQ situation with a long-distance, it can get really complicated really fast, which is why it’s helpful to have someone untangle the mess for you and point you in the right direction.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yes.

Chris Seiter:
Well, we don’t want you to think that Tyler, me, or Anna are only just … Tyler specializes in pretty much every single situation, he’s not just LGBTQ or attachment, he actually had a lot of success, I noticed in the Facebook group a couple weeks ago, one of his first clients was a pregnant girl, and she was already getting some pretty positive results from the session. So, it’s not like we’re a one-trick pony, we are trained to do more, but Tyler has probably got some of most mind-blowing knowledge I’ve ever seen on the LGBTQ side of things with regards to the fear of loss greater, but later, out or not, things like that, where I’m just not going to have as good of information as you will have.

Tyler Ramsey:
Well, I think it probably helps that I have personal experience with it, when you probably don’t identify with that community.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah, I’m like a blind man grasping in the dark for …

Tyler Ramsey:
Exactly.

Chris Seiter:
Which is why Tyler’s going to be writing the article, not me, so that you’re getting it from exactly the authority who knows what he’s talking about, as opposed to me, who would just literally be like, “I don’t know what I’m talking about, but this sounds like it might work.”

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, exactly. I do think it always helps when you’ve had … I mean I’ve had to navigate these situations myself, and so I have personal experience as well, so I feel like that helps a lot.

Chris Seiter:
Well, thanks for coming on, Tyler, this was pretty awesome actually. So, we’re going to have to do more LGBTQ-type content to build up our inventory because there is a pretty sizeable amount of people coming to our websites that are looking for this, and there’s just nothing there right now.

Tyler Ramsey:
Yeah, exactly. I think we should also say this too: comment down in the comments below and tell us what you want your questions answered too because sometimes we’re not always thinking, and it’s always helpful to know what our audience is wanting answers to.

Chris Seiter:
Yeah. Also, we’ll read it and we’ll be like, “Why didn’t we say that? It was so obvious.” All right, well, comment below, and we’ll be back with more stuff later.

Tyler Ramsey:
Sounds good.